This quality chat was with punk rock pat and was published in COMBAT #1. Check them out here on the
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Enjoy....
Well daggers rule isn't an active band anymore, but what was the most stable line-up? Edge status?Probably our most stable Line Up was Mikey on Drums, Joe Mama on Bass and Devon on Guitar. We played some really good gigs with that lineup, including a ripping 2 shows in one day fun fest that included the gig you put on with Outbreak and Stand Accused in Auburn (you know, the one where I probably got the venue shut down by going through the wall during Outbreaks cover of “Right Brigade”?), and a metal show at the Half Penny with the last season, where they showed slasher flicks on tv monitors while we were playing. Good lineup. Nobody that has played in any lineup of Daggers Rule is still straight edge, except for one lone wolf, and that would be Patrick Michael Wilding, esquire.
As far as music goes, what did daggers rule put out?We put out two different sessions out as self released demos. “Gnar-b-Que” from our second session ended up on the Assault City comp. on Reaper. Our 7” on Barbarossa records compiles the entirety of the first demo with two extra tracks from the Jocko session.
Pat you've been into syracuse hardcore longer then me, what would you say was the best local band over the years? Also, syracuse had a somewhat explosion of bands from 03 and on, how does that compare to say the mid 90s?I’ve given this a shit ton of thought over the past day or so, and it is an incredibly difficult call, so I’m going to give you a half assed answer, because picking one is just too damn difficult. As far as the band that had the biggest impact on “the scene” (not to mention me, as a lad) as it were, and put Syracuse on the map, I mean duh, Earth Crisis. Live, they were a force to be reckoned with, had important things to say and were genuinely enraged about the injustices around them, and were certainly not afraid of letting you know. As far my personal favorite band overall, I’d probably pick the Funeral if I had a gun to my head. They had something for everyone. Heavy as fuck, fast, metal level musicianship, but still very much a hardcore band, one of the best live presences I’ve ever seen in a band as a collective whole, great conscious and progressive lyrics, pissed as fuck, AND they covered Infest, His Hero is Gone and Agnostic Front. How can you fuck with that? Black SS is my fave 315 band that’s still around though. To address the second part of your question Dan, I’d actually say that there are a lot of parallels between Syracuse hardcore in 1992-93 and ten years later. In the early 90’s a new sound was emerging, and a lot of the old Syracuse punks and Skins were going the way of the Buffalo, or getting into the whole E chug big pants vibe. The death metal scene was dying a slow agonizing death, the gurgles of which can still be heard today. There was a whole crop of younger bands, Framework (Pre ExC) Infusion, Flakjacket, Bonejack, Uprising (Later Green Rage), Soulstice and of course Earth Crisis. A lot of those bands only had demo’s out and there would still be a ton of kids flipping out for them. It was an awe inspiring if not a little scary time to start going to shows. None of these bands were doing anything purely original music wise but they were combining a few pre existing genre’s in some pretty innovative ways, and it was cool to hear a sound unique to the region developing. A lot of early 90’s Syracuse hardcore brings to mind Burn, Late era Turning Point and Inside Out with a shredded out almost speed metal guitar approach. Integrity’s those who fear tomorrow was a huge influence too. The Syracuse bands slowed down those influences a notch, and helped emphasize their lyrical focus, which were of the militant Vegan/SxE variety. Flakjacket and Infusion were definitely the black sheep, due to Flakjacket having skinheads in the band and sounding more like Breakdown than anything else and Infusion having a very prenounced Slayer influence. Both band’s were not exclusively SxE, back then, that was a bigger deal then it is now. Now fast forward 10 years later. The Syracuse scene, had gone through a lot of phases. John McKaig the promoter who put us on the map has all but completely retired except for the occasional new years day show. Hellfest was massive, and although it was good for Syracuse in the sense that it brought a lot of people up to the area to see bands, employed scenester’s like me to build stages, and I’m sure, got a whole new crop of younger kids into hardcore, metal, commercial emo etc., but in my eyes it had strayed a billion miles off the course of what hardcore had begun as in that town. Venues, had continued to be a problem, the Lost Horizon, our CBGB’s, had all but closed it’s doors completely with only the occasional show going on. There were a few venues for the bigger bands like Bane and such, but they were too big for a Grassroots, intimate hardcore show. The Planet 505 was a good mid sized venue, but it’s tenure as a venue did not last too long. Thankfully, there was the Westcott. The Westcott community center had been gaining momentum since the mid 90’s when guys like Ryan Hex, Keith Allen, Grant Johnson and Bob Swift started booking shows there. By 2003, a lot of the “older guy’s” along with some fresh faces started forming bands and playing shows. The Funeral, AWOL, Another Breath, We The People, Attitude, Hit the Lights, Whiteout, Walk the Line, John Waynes Severed Head (holding it down for the Punks), Ed Gein ( already been around for a few years and weren’t hardcore in musical style, but certainly were in ethics and spirit) and my two bands. There was a good amount of activity bubbling up, as well a lot of younger kids like Megz and Pauly Edge going to shows, booking shows, and publishing zines. After the planet closed it’s doors more and more of the focus of the scene was around the Westcott and there was a pretty big influx of kids aged 14 – 20 that came out of the woodwork to support it. Towards the end of the 90’s, there were a lot of bands I didn’t “Get” or particularly enjoy musically playing shows at the lost and Hungry Charlies. I’m not going to name any names, but the whole “Hard Guy” thug fantasy stuff was not what I was feeling at the time. I actually like a lot more of that stuff now, hahaha. The Westcott was always a good alternative where you could see bands like Monster X, Voorhees, The Pissed Officer’s etc, with like 20 other people. Also the rebirth of fast punk style hardcore began there as well with Set in Motion and Eternal Youth gigging there very frequently. Keith in Hell booked a lot of metal there too, which was something different at the time. By 2003 though, the Westcott was pretty much on par with the other venues in terms of attendance and crowd participation. There was bunch of new bands who were doing there own take on Hardcore Punk music, and were all friends, as well really awesome well known bands that drew lot’s of kids from all over Upstate started to play. The Rambo, Tear it Up, and No Time Left gigs there were milestones. It was definitely a new era. So where hardcore in 93 was a bunch of kids reinventing a preexisting sound and subculture by playing music on their own terms so was the Birth of ACHC in 2003. People can say what want about bands rehashing 80’s style hardcore, but AWOL, Black SS, The Funeral, The Promise and Daggers Rule and the rest of our colleagues where all taking different influences and doing something different with it, because Metalcore was getting stale. There’s my novel. Christ that’s long and convoluted. I hope it makes sense.
Are there any unreleased songs recorded or non?Well, both demos had extremely limited runs, but yeah all the recorded material is out there. There is an alternate version of “Never Deny” that we recorded for our second demo with Jocko that never saw a proper release or Vinyl though. Hopefully somebody can use it for a comp. or something someday because I prefer it to the older version. It sounds a lot more like The Bruiser’s kicking the dogshit out of The Accused, which was the sound that was initially intended.
Explain "you just bought it!" for the folks at home and why has it become legendary to 315 hardcore ?So DR’s playing one of the first (maybe the very first?) Unholy gigs with Dead Hearts and Plan 607 (I hope I got their name right) The latter were a bunch of older dudes that played heavily Misfits influenced punk with a metal tinge to it. Great bunch of guys, but I didn’t really know them too well as they played the Syracuse bar circuit almost exclusively, and rarely played all ages shows. Not knocking that, I just didn’t really know these guys. One of them was my old roommates Boss at a restaurant at Carousel mall, I think. Anyhoozle, in Joe Mama’s heyday in DR he always had to borrow bass gear from fools. I think he’s got some massive shit now for Architect, but back then he was what you would term a “Borrower”. So to play the Unholy show, the Bassist from Planet 505 from outer space lends him this massive tower of bass cabbage. I think Devon may have negotiated the lend, as he knew those guys too. I think. So we’re flipping out, I’m summoning hell with my throat muscles and jumping 12 feet in the air, Devon’s playing guitar, Mikey’s playing drums, and Joe Mamma isn’t so much playing bass as he was reliving those glory day’s of the late 90’s when guys in “Noise Core” (Deadguy, Coalesce, Early Dillinger) bands would attack the crowd with their instruments, by well, attacking the crowd with his instrument. It’s cool. At first, I was against it. It just didn’t make any sense, and I am a positive man. Over time though, I realized that Dagger’s Rule was a culmination of a lot of people, personalities and musical influences that didn’t make any sense, so whatevs. Life’s a garden, dig it. SO…in the midst of the THC soaked Hessian maelstrom that was Joe Mamma’s stage act, I notice that the young mans instrument cable is very taut. Slapping my forehead in dismay I rush to the ride side of the floor in a vain attempt to prevent the ugly inevitability about to take place. All for naught, I’m afraid. I could make an inappropriate 911 joke here, but since my name isn’t Choke, nor am I in that abortion of band called “Leftover Crack” I will not, that would be in poor, poor taste. Let’s just say that cab went down like Rosie O’donnel at the Lilith Fair. With a thud, the megalithic amp fell face first, and for about 10-15 secs. Joe didn’t notice, he was still raging. It was then that the bassist from Plan of Attack 77 runs over and points to his fallen gear and yells “YOU JUST BOUGHT IT!!!”. That yell echoed through the canyons of time. The first man to climb out of the primordial ooze heard it. Caligula heard it when he was banging a horse. Reginald Denny heard it when he was getting his ass handed to him by rioters. Rollins heard it when he sang “Clocked In” with Black Flag the very first time in NYC. This sentence is eternal. This was to become a catch phrase that would make “Where’s the beef?” look like “Don’t tase me bro!”. Braaains wrote a song about it, and people recited those words endlessly and with reckless abandon. When my other band at the time Hand of Glory went on tour with I Object, we must have yelled “YOU JUST BOUGHT IT!!!” at least 800 times per person, and at least 250 times all in unison. Ted AB incorporated it into his stage banter at a show we played with Another Breath on that tour which caused the crowd at the “Pirates Cove” in Allentown Pa, to explode into 7 person circle pit. The proprietors of the establishment were not pleased with our display of joy, and lectured us in a very Kent McClard circa 1992 manner. I would just like to take this opportunity to say fuck them. I’d also like to say “YOU JUST BOUGHT IT!!!” Thanks for the gas money, dweebs.
I remember the night you guys recorded the first demo at more sound... Tell me about that night and what you remember most.To be honest man, I don’t remember that much. I remember recording the gang vocals for “Pissing out the Poison” with a bunch of people that aren’t edge anymore, and the unfinished 1st floor of Moresound having piles of shit everywhere, and keeping the weird sniff at the beginning of “Do not taunt happy fun ball”. I remember Greg Pier being fucking rad as shit, that’s what I remember.
airwalks with lace protectors, slide rails, tail guards, everslicks... What was the one thing skating back in the day could of done without?Lace Guards – Ineffective, but pretty cool looking.
Rails – Protected sick Jim Phillips and Pushead graphics. Necessary.
Bridgebolts – I still use them
Everslicks – Fast sliding, good stuff.
Tail Guards – Okay we can ditch these. I need to maximize my ollies.
My favorite skate apparel from back then was my black pants with the red vision down the leg and my crucial skate rags jacket.. How about yours?Ok, peep this shit. I would rock a pair of Ratbones sweat pants, or Limpies (there were like Skidz but thicker, for skaters), my black denim jacket with Anthrax logo on the back and fingerless studded leather gloves. I skated several different Natas decks over the years.
So tell me about the new 7" that just came out.Joshua T. Smith put it out. It’s the first release on his label Barbarossa. Josh rules, and I’m really flattered that he wanted to release our demo stuff on vinyl. The artwork is by none other than the immortal Mike Tommyrot. He play’s the gits in your band, you know him. Tattooist extraordinaire, keen edged old punker, artist for everyone from the Boils to Path of Resistance. It looks like an old Santa Cruz graphic, but considerably gorier. Perfect. As of late, I’ve grown really tired of “Party Thrash” type bands with skating themes, and I’m glad we only wrote one skate song. I think that Mike really did that style justice for the art though. The colored vinyl looks wonderful as well.
You guys are playing a reunion show in late december in syracuse. Is this going to be the final dr show?Nope. Our "last show” was a total farce so we decided that since we have a record out, we should play a record release. We’re currently holding conferences to determine whether or not we want to go out for a weekend. I think us calling it a day might have been a bit hasty. It’s a fun band to play in, and I don’t see the issue with playing the occasional gig for yucks. There seems to be a fair amount of kids that want to see us now. I wish they were there when we played with Have Heart and there was no one there because my 5 friends went to go get burritos, but you know, I’ll take four years later. S’cool.
Sum daggers rule up in 5 words.You really just bought it.
Name your top 5 bands not named BOLD...(hahaha)Man, you gotta let this bold thing go. Hahahaha.
The Accused
Husker Du
Saint Vitus
Sheer Terror
New Model Army
These are subject to change at any time.
ATTITUDE- the ill faced method demo
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